Philosophy Amazing Grace

[HHIgirl]

Has anyone else tried the Philosophy fragrances? I bought the Amazing Grace TSV a while back and I absolutely adore it. It really does what it says and gives you such a lift when you spray it. I also like the Message in a bottle which is available as a shower gel and spritz. It is nice for the summer and my beau enjoys it for himself as well.

[Curvigirl]

I have fallen in love with Falling In Love--I spritzed on a bit walking through Sephora a couple of weeks ago, went on my merry way, got to the car and had to turn back and go buy it. It's great!

[HHIgirl]

Curvi, I forgot that one even exsisted. Can you describe the smell or should I say the floral or citrus make up of that scent? It might be worth the hour drive to my Sephora.

[Curvigirl]

Very sweet and clean--like berries and soap. Weird, but very nice!

[HHIgirl]

ohhhhhhhh, that sounds pleasantly strange and uplifting. I look forward to trying that one out.

[Curvigirl]

I even spray it in the air just to get an extra whiff now and then!

[shopreturn]

I like A.G., but love, love, LOVE Falling in Love. So far I just have the shower gel.

QVC how has a Discovery Kit that gives samples of all the grace fragrances, but not the falling in love. Also travel sized basic skin care line, hope and a prayer, and a AG shower gel. Plus a sample of the resurface kit. It's A0970 and costst $36. Sorry, the intro/try-me price is gone. Still a good price.

My sneaking suspicion (often proven wrong) is that the TSV on April 18 might feature bath/body carefragrances. I would like both skin care and fragrance, like the last TSV (I bought two), but don't know if they'll repeat so soon.

My idea TSV would be a resurface kit and some falling in love products.

[shopreturn]

oops, got some of the contents wrong on that kit and it's on waitlist, but they usually fulfill those.

[carly04]

baby Grace is also wonderful.... it is for adults.. not children.... I highly recommend it

[aloe]

I love Amazing Grace, too. Glad to hear a description of Falling in Love...have wanted to try it for a long time. Has anyone ever tried Tova's fragrances?

[Shopgirl]

I hope the TSV on 4/18 is a Falling in Love set...

I LOVE that perfume! It smells like berries and vanilla, is a bit powdery...hard to explain. But it smells scrumpcious.

I also like the Baby Grace perfume, and would love the TSV to be something dealing with that.

[SBTZMom]

I tried TOVA Nights many years ago. It was a bit too heavy for me...more musky then I usually wear. I returned it.

I am more into fresh scents...green tea, verbena...that kind of thing. I use the L'Occitane Verbena lotion and fragrance and love it. I also love the E. Arden green tea, and the Lancome Aromatonique.

[SnowTiger]

Good grief I think I've tried them all!
What is wrong with me?
I have the amazing grace on autoship from a tsv a while back. It may be me, but the more I wear it, the less I'm impressed. It seems to lose it's scent on me pretty fast. It's ok and my fave of the four I describe here. Simple and light, nice.

I've only smelled a sample of falling in love and it does smell terrific! I've been tempted to get it several times but am afraid it may overwhelm me after an hour or so. Some of these that do have a personality make me nauseous after an hour. I tend to like things simple.

Tova. The signature fragrance is simple and clean smelling. It's mild and pleasant. It lasts all day on me, anyway. Not as great as people go on and on about on QVC, however, but what truly is?

Tova nights. A little heavier but much lighter than most stuff out there. Pretty close to the signature. Not a fan of this one. I like this the least of her three that I've tried.

Tova Body Mind and Spirit. Pretty happy, up, light day fragrance. Not bad. 2nd fave Tova.

BTW, i just went to my bedroom to get the above fragrances to remind myself of their scents. My hubby is just silently looking at me like "I wonder what Lucy Ricardo is up to now?"
I do keep him on his toes!!!

[poodle]

I lOVE LOVE LOVE Falling in love...in answer to other questions I think that it smells like cotton candy! Wierd but true...I dont even like cotten candy...but I cant get enough of the stuff. My only complaint is that I wish that they made it in a parfume so that it would have more staying power. I have tons of fragrences but this is the one that I allmost allways reach for. In fact the Amazing Grace and Falling in Love are the only 2 scents that I have ever used up and had to replace!
How ever- does that Christine woman anoy anyone else????
It doesnt stop me from being a devotee to the Philosphy line but still she IRKS me big time!

[Sittin'n]

Hey, all ... I have the Amazing Grace TSV on auto-delivery. What a fabulous value! I love AG, but have noticed it's not long-lasting. Does anyone know of other perfumes that are clean-smelling? I prefer a just-showered-fresh-as-a-daisy aroma.

Poodle: What "irks" you 'bout Christina?

[yankee]

try the rice flower and shea body splash from bath & body. i've never gotten so many compliments on any fragrance as i do when i wear that.

[poodle]

I'm not quite sure...weeeelllllll it could be that she has, like, a minus 20 sense of humor.....and she talks thru gritted teeth....and she is one of those folk who is allways right/ did it before you/ did it better than you.....
Hmmm perhaps I have some issues here! Am I turning into "Sniffles"??????
BUT I do adore thier stuff so perhaps I should just move on from my irratation and put on my "Save Me'" and call it a night!

[Sittin'n]

Yankee: Thank you! I'll look for the Rice Flower and Shea Body Splash at Bath and Body. Do you wear them together?

[yankee]

don't worry, poodle. you're not even close to being a 'sniffles'. we all have hosts and / or vendors who get under our skin. just be glad you're the capable professional shopper you are, and can get past that to still buy the product!

[yankee]

'rice flower and shea' is one scent. if i want it to last longer, i layer it with the body lotion. generally, i don't need it. it's not strong, but it stays with me.

[Sittin'n]

Poodle: LOL, now that you mention it, Christina does say "wellll." Christina doesn't possess an effusive personality, but I really like her. (Could be cuz I live with two introverts!)

Do tell, how do you like Save Me? I haven't tried it; Nordstrom is always out of THAT, too! Christina says it's fab.

Poodle, you're not sniffle-like! LOL

P.S. My blasted PM box keeps sending messages my PM box is full, but when I attempt to delete, there's NOTHING there!!! Arrggghhhh!

[Sittin'n]

Thanks again, Yankee! Since I live quite a distance from the mall, I won't be able to sample the Rice Flower and Shea for a while, but will let you know when I do. Thank-you!!!

[yankee]

you're very welcome!

[poodle]

Sittin- the save me is great....I feel like it sloughs away all of the bad...because I am only 35 and it is for older skin and my skin tends to be like the desert I only use it every so often...did you get my note on the origins of my screen name? It is a tribute to my dog Zoe the most un-poodle Anatolian Shepherd....she is a very tounge in fang kind of gal with the MOST Fab gold and pink chinese print coller- just got it for her last weekend- now we can be coordinated when walking down the street...ala pink Coach bag

[Sittin'n]

Poodle: Thank you for the Save Me testimony!
I bet you and your pooch look FAB together, lol!

No, I didn't get your message. I don't know WHAT is amiss with my blasted PM box. I receive messages stating my PM box is full, but when attemtping to empty the PM box, NOTHING is there. I sent you my e-mail addy instead, which I wuz gonna post on the BB, until I read Sniffles'/Pete's story of the guy who decapitated his girlfriend and drove around with her head as a trophy!!! FOMCL

[sueb]

Philosophy---I've been using the Hope in a Jar and Purity wash and the other stuff that came in the Try me. My skin has never , ever looked this good and I'm 57 with very dry skin.
Can't say enough about this product line. When I hit the Sephora when I'm in SPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAM for convention, I will load up and save the shipping.

Want to try Falling in Love after you guys gave it such a great review.

I'm new here, great, fun forum.

[shopreturn]

Poodle...I've heard and agree to an extent about the cotton candy description. But softer and cleaner
I don't agree about Christina however. I like listening to her! Although some of her stock phrases get to be redundant.

Sueb....hi and nice to meet you. As I said in another thread, if I could only use ONE skin care line, it would be philosophy. (Since I can use more than one, I do ...probably 6-7! haha).
If you cannot wait until Las SPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAM, check out SPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAMSPAM.com and/or beauty.com. (they're connected). Free shipping over I think 49 bucks, no tax. And often they have freebies with purchase. And you get something off if it's your first purchase.

[SnowTiger]

Poodle,
LOL!! I TOTALLY agree with you on CHristina!! That is the dark haired owner, whatever, right? I thought she was a scientist the first time I saw her because she was acting like she was one!! She was going on and on about creating some line that plastic surgeons just use and use or something. Blah, blah, blah.

I too LOVE the philosophy line, though Hope in a JAr is just WAY too greasy for me.
Also, what do you think of the sayings on the bottles? I remember her going on and on about how she writes those and has others fix them grammatically, but they just pop into her head! Well, big deal. I just find them insipid. I bet I could write one right now in two seconds. Hmm

OBSTACLES
The purpose of life can be found in the tests not the RESTS. Learning to climb up that hill and appreciating the easy slide down the other side BECAUSE of the obstacles faced and overcome. In the end, it all comes down to that one litttle word "obstacles." It is not how many you have, but how you handle them, learn from them that defines you as a woman ... as a WINNER.
UGGH! Stupid and Cheesy right? Sorry, but at least I KNOW it is crap! Go back and reread your bottles and see if I'm exaggerating!! They just all sound like all that pseudo-intellectual phiosophy crap that a college freshman would write and recite because it's "deep." It's just silly to me.
LOVE MOST of the line though.

[yankee]

i [don't] think, therefore i shop.

[Denim&Co.]

I shop (@ QVC) therefore I am. :,)

[shopreturn]

*Cracking up at SnowTiger's post*

too funny.

I still like Christina. She does try to talk a bit above-level. Do you know she didn't graduate from college? I got that tidbit from a segment of "stripped"--on the style network I think?

Maybe she's compensating. Not that college makes you smart

[yankee]

well, it certainly makes you poor!

[Denim&Co.]

Where is "tattletales"? The last(and first) time it was on was summer. The products are still on qvc.com. The line was created by Christina and designed to hide those ugly things we would rather hide, like manhands, dirty elbows, rats nest hair, and sunspots...ugh!

[astute]

I don't care what educational background Christina has, as I know people with PHD's who can't tie their own shoe strings. She started a medical company called Bio-Medics, which she subsequently sold, but remains on the Board of Directors. I find her line of products, including Hope In a Jar wonderful, and certainly not greasy. I also find the "writing" on the packages very creative and entertaining.

In my opinion, she does not "talk over our head", but I guess it depends on who is listening. She explains her products better than many other vendors, and what she states about her products, I have found to be true, and I use most of what is offered on QVC.

My feeling is if someone is that dissatisfied with the vendor and/or the product, don't watch and don't buy. It is fine to disagree with what a vendor or whomever does, and to provide constructive criticism, but is making fun of someone really necessary?

[carly04]

Philosphy, has the very best scented shower products I have... I was in a Sephora store , recently, and I was like a kid in a candy store.. purchased several of the Philosphy shower products.. in lemon; Lime; and Strawberry.... I just finished Choclate hip Cookie recently, from the Christmas Holiday.. very nice......it's a very good line...

[shopreturn]

Astute.
I'm not sure you are addressing my comments, or SnowTigers, but I'll offer these thoughts in reply.

There's a big difference between making fun of someone and making fun of what is written on the bottles of the products.

Christina's achievements, despite lack of formal education, are that much more impressive. I thought my post was clear that "education does not make you smart." And saying a person is talking "above-level" quoting myself, is ~not~ the same thing as saying someone is talking above your head, as you quote. She merely explains her product on a level that is clearly above/different from the great majority of beauty products vendors, either on QVC or elsewhere. That's merely an observation.

On the other hand, your response of "that depends on who is listening, comes off like a bit of a slam. Perhaps you didn't mean it that way. I'm going to assume the best here! : )

I think most, if not all, posting here love the philosophy line, including myself, so I don't understand your admonition to "not watch, not buy." Can't we express reactions to a way of presentation, either by the vendor or in the packaging.

Let's keep it light! Not so serious! We're here to have fun, right?

[KarynLR]

Snow Tiger... I agree with you about Amazing Grace losing it's scent quickly. I love it, so I try to layer and spray it often, in my closet, in my armoire, etc.

As for the entire line, I adore it. I did not start off with Philosophy from QVC; I started at Sephora. Christina can tell me how to use the products better than anyone! We're well-stocked at home (but eagerly await the TSV!), but I watched part of the 3 hour show to learn how to better use the products. I will say this: when I started seeing my dermatologist 6 years ago, I started using Cetaphil and Complex 15 moisturizer. I loved them. I called Complex 15 the moisturizer sent from God. Then I found Philosophy. The products are phenomenal; they work, like Christina says, and I'm currently switching over to her basic skin care line. I am a very wary product consumer; I must have spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars on acne cures before I saw the derm, and I will not buy any next thing on the shelf, but Philosophy is amazing. The only thing I'm not happy with is the Kiss Me. I use Aveda Lip Saver, which is pricier than Kiss Me (Kiss Me lasts longer), but something I will never ever be without. If anyone goes to an Aveda salon or has a store nearby, you MUST pick it up! I buy it 6,7 at a time and stash them everywhere!

[carly04]

KarynLr... Is this Aveda a lip gloss or chapstick? I have been usuing Burt's Bee's chapstick... but always willing to try something new. I also love the Philosphy line.... esp. the shower products... and Sephora is the best place to buy them... just not too many places near me.. the only Sephora in the entire state of Pa. is in Pittsburgh!

[SnowTiger]

shopreturn,

Hear, HEAR!!! Preach on, sista!! But I'm sure it is to me that she has directed that latest missive.

Astute,
You've responded so STRONGLY and negatively to me in several posts and, maybe I'm paranoid here, but what is the deal? Must I get chided after every sixth post I make?
I thought I explained myself on an earlier thread. I'm here to share opinions, swap stories, and just have a chuckle. That's me. I like to poke fun at the vendors, show hosts, and products. I really don't mean any harm. Sorry, but I just don't take QVC as seriously as you seem to. I know that not EVERYBODY agrees with my opinion, or your's either, so just live and let live, ok? I was going to start a thread of our own philosophy labels, but good grief forget it. I feel like that just isn't proper or welcome here. That making-fun-of-something thing.
I stated twice that i do like other things about the line so I am not dissatisfied with Philosophy. That is terrific that you like hope in a jar, a lot of people here share that opinion. I was just saying how it affected ME.
If this board only allows or wants serious, positive, formal discussions, then I'll just leave because I'm definitely at THE wrong place. I'm already not posting as often as I was. I like a lively board and if anyonne can point me to one that fits me better, I'll go. Til then, I will continue to express my opinions here and I really hope you do as well. Please feel free to skip any and all posts I make. I do hope that if you disagree with me that you feel comfortable to state your opinion, but PLEASE lay off that "you can change the channel crap." I know that. We ALL know that.
Can't we all just have fun and get along?
Oh and if you were not talking to me than, as I've said before,
my definite bad.

[Sittin'n]

shopreturn, SnowTiger: ^5 and AMEN, my sistahs! Aren't we gathering to share, shop, and SUPPORT one another?

Astute, I genuinely value you, but I ALREADY have two parents. And unless you pay my bills and sleep with me, NO ONE has the right to tell me what (or what NOT!) to post!

Honestly, I appreciate and RESPECT our differences (hey, Alfie!), and have LEARNED so much about varying viewpoints. So, PLEASE, don't leave, SnowTiger! I'm eager to hear your opinion---even if we disagree---your observations are VALID!

Love to each and EVERY one on this BB!

[Denim&Co.]

Sorry, I am guilty of making fun of a few QVC and HSN hosts and models. But it is harmless, I'm not stalking anyone. We are the viewers of the shopping networks and see people in our own way. We are each intitled to our own opinion. Some just like to share their thoughts, others go to far. Like what Sittin'n said, I'm an independent person and have my differences from everyone else. Astute, I enjoy reading your posts, but it is unnecessary to tell us what we should or should not say. I don't want anyone, including snowtiger to stop posting just because of what one of us said.

[occaseshpr]

Sittin', you KNOW I have come to respect and like you (there's more to life than the pages at this bb, IYKWIM) and have very much enjoyed the others who post here. But I've gotta take this opportunity to ask you if you TRULY "adore" ALL of the posters here??? ("Sniffles" too?) And that special "hey, Alfie" in regard to "differences"....please help me (and perhaps others who are confused) to understand how you can "adore" a writer of posts such as Alpha's at #17 on this thread? And I know you've seen some of the others which are just FULL of hate and derision and ugly language. I'm NO PRUDE and don't have the answers, but I'm remembering how you said a few times that you don't like posts which are mean, among other descriptions. Could Alpha get much MORE mean? No matter what the impetus, the content is rarely anything BUT derisive. What gives?

[Denim&Co.]

I also want to know why you said that Sittin'n. We are friends :) but I don't know how you can like all posters. There are certain users on this BB that I just cannot adore. Posters that use foul language and certain other mannerisms(constantly using capital letters) annoy my very much and make me think "Why here?"

[Sittin'n]

OC: In my heart, I can TRULY say I harbor no resentment or anger toward ANY posters on this BB. "Adore" may have been a little too charitable, so I altered my post to appease you and others who are offended by that term of endearment.

Btw, alpha didn't post # 17 on this thread, as you stated.




Sheesh, hold on, SnowTiger, I'm comin' with you! LOL

[occaseshpr]

Okay, I feel like this is getting close to being majorly (a word?) antagonistic. Not fun, lately. I for sure didn't intend for any wiseass behavior around here....what do you think this is, the Sopranos?

Sittin, 1)I would NEVER be "offended" by the term "adore" and YOU KNOW THAT! I was just questioning the extent to which you were including recipients of your adoration. If you choose to include the posters to whom I referred that's your choice. And as far as "appeasing" me or anybody else, don't feel that I need you to tread lightly....I'm a big girl.

2)I don't "harbor any ANGER" either!!! But I DO hold "resentment" for posters who are openly cruel and/or vicious. If you look back on some of YOUR posts, you pretty much said the same. Not necessarily the word "resent", but a description of disapproval.

3) YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT ABOUT MY MISSTATEMENT: ALPHA's POST WAS #17 at the "JUDY'S 1st MARRIAGE THREAD" And, Lord knows, there are countless others of similar content on other threads and other forums.

4) I hope you and SnowTiger will be very happy wherever that is you're goin'! Just hope YOU won't be the target of that jungle! Sheesh backatcha.

[Denim&Co.]

I don't want you to leave Sittin'n! Continue making your posts and if you adore all users, that's fine. We all have opinions that can be appreciated. Sittin, I don't care for some posters but they are not all bad. Don't go!

Sweet dreams Sittin'n, I hope your back tomorrow!

[Sittin'n]

Thanks, and sweet dreams to you, too, Denim.

[occaseshpr]

I guess I'M outta here, not you. This acknowledgment of nastiness and "goodnatured" or "harmless" treatment of goodhearted people is NOT for me!!!!! I'm just too much of a rooter for the true underdog. A special thanks and best wishes to the folks who have been dedicated to trying to keep up forums of a kind nature. Keep smiling....THAT can come through in the written word, too! Bye all----occasional electronic shopper.

[shopreturn]

hey, hey HEY......I was enjoyin' being adored for a couple moments there! : )

On a serious note (ugh), I hope I didn't start anything negative here. I think very highly of Astute. She comes across as a very intelligent, loyal and caring person. I admire her so much for what she did in another thread. You all know what Im talking about. I think it's her loyalty and caring that may have caused her to reply the way she did to me and/or SnowTiger. And that's fine. We should be able to take that for what it is, too...her opinion! We all should be able to say how we feel.

I haven't talked to Occaeshpr, but have enjoyed all her posts. Please do not leave!!!

Now I'm feelin' bad. Maybe it's just hormones....or the grey rainy day.

[astute]

I have read all of your posts and none of you need to leave. I am more than willing to leave this Board.

The sad part is that women can be their worst enemies; perhaps my problem is that as an Executive before I became too ill to work, I worked with men and they would accept differing opinions and not view them as attacks. And they would never write such personally "attack" posts.

As a parting suggestion, meant in a positive way, go back and read your posts back and forth to each other on this thread, and maybe the group of you, who are very close, can patch things up. I hope so.

I never really belonged here, and was simply lonely being housebound. For those of you I offended, I apologize.

Good luck to you all, and I hope that you all continue to post.

[shopreturn]

Astute
You have contributed a lot to this board. Your departure would be a loss and wholly unnecessary, unless based upon something personal--not a few words written here. Our differences make this place interesting!

Stay, please.

[Sittin'n]

astute, as previously stated, I genuinely value you AND your input. Please stay.

Everyone: To clarify my aforementioned post (yet again), what I meant to convey: " 'Adore' may have been a little too charitable, so I altered my post to appease you and others whom are offended by that term of endearment (in that context)."

I have NO hidden agenda here; that's not my style. But it IS my perogative to treat alpha with kindness, regardless of how subversive my approach may be perceived. I'm not urging anyone to embrace any poster, so if my dialogue with alpha incites wrath, please, don't read it.

[occaseshpr]

no "wrath" on my part. just noticing a turn of personality traits that I don't feel comfortable with. Again, bye.

[Sittin'n]

Gosh, we have yet another thing in common, OC; I wuz thinkin' the same thing about YOU! Lol....

[astute]

I read the Board one last time as I was concerned about "Sniffles" and Lisa R. I read these posts, and Shopreturn, please know that there is nothing "personal" about me leaving the Board, and that the reasons I stated are the only ones. I appreciate your kind words.

Sittin'n, I have not felt any "wrath" towards any of your posts, including to Alpha. I don't understand the posts to Alpha, but that is none of my busines.

I sincerely hope that with me not posting after this that some of the conflict will go away. I read the post by Denim&Co, that I assume was aimed at me, and addressed to Snowtiger, asking that she not leave because of one person. Denim&Co said: "I don't want anyone, including Snowtiger to stop posting just because of what one of us said." Snowtiger was offended by my response to her Philosophy post. Hopefully now, Snowtiger will stay, as that one person is gone.

Best wishes.

[shopreturn]

but Astute.......I don't think you should leave because of one person's words in one post anymore than Snowtiger should stop saying whatever she wants because of one person, or ANY of us stop expressing ourselves. (ok, I hope you all know I'm not including extreme profanity, hate-speech or the creepazoid types in other threads.)

c'mon.....I really don't think there's any terribly serious or unmendable conflict here. Just different points of view. But we know that diversity enriches. And perhaps we've over-reacted. I'm guilty of that too. Let's accept our imperfections and that of others.

So what do you say we all just forget about it and talk about Philosophy???

Someone mentioned they didn't care for the KissMe, and I wanted to ask why? I have some and have not opened it yet. If not good, I may list it on ebay! : )

[Sittin'n]

Astute, I wasn't referring to you when I mentioned the Alpha "debate." Please stay, Astute.

[Denim&Co.]

I don't want you to go, astute. I am glad you contacted QVC about sniffles/Pete. In that one quote I was referring how snowtiger was talking about leaving. I don't want just a small diference in opinion to cause a member to leave. Astute, continue posting please, and if one of us gets too out of hand making fun of a host or someone, feel free to try to stop that. Small little jokes here and there are in many of our posts, and are not harmful until it goes too far. I hope I have not offended you greatly astute, you are a great poster.

[SnowTiger]

Astute,
I agree with what shopreturn said about three posts ago. There is NO reason for ANY one to leave. No reason at all. We are all adults here and we all have a right to express an opinion. It just seemed to me that you just "patroled" behavior a bit too much. I was NOT "offended" by your post, I was just made to feel "unwelcome." I didn't think you were crtiquing my opinion, PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE, but rather my STYLE. I thought you were just reading my silly posts WAY to seriously. I am sure that you are a lovely person with a terrific sense of humour. I just wish that I saw it in your posts more often. I promise I'll show my serious side more, BUT YOU WON't LIKE IT!!!! Now that was a joke. I'll bet one could read that as a threat! :) In fact, I think we often forget just how easy it is for the original intent of a post to be misinterpreted. Maybe you didn't mean for the post to come across as it did. To me it just seemed like you were playing mom, not expressing a differing opinion among equals, but correcting a wayward child. I guess I would like to see you as a friend and not another mom or, for goodness sake, another BOSS. Geeesh, I leave THAT train wreck every day at 3:30!!! Sorry, another story, another time.
BOTTOM LINE, DON'T YOU DARE LEAVE!!! You have intelligent posts that are interesting to read and GOD knows, we need MORE intelligent people sharing their opinions just to keep up with all the idiots out there spouting off DAILY!!! I'm sorry you are housebound, but I look forward to you keeping us informed on what is happening during the weekday on QVC that is good, bad, and UGLY!! You are intelligent and I like that you and others like you contribute here.

[Sittin'n]

SnowTiger: Sooo well said! Thank you! Your comment, "In fact, I think we often forget just how easy it is for the original intent of a post to be misinterpreted." certainly applies to this debacle!

[yankee]

may i make a suggestion? as much as you all like philosophy amazing grace, i suggest we start a new thread about it so this one will eventually disappear. hopefully, as it does, all this junk can be put behind us, too. pay attention to the title, people. let's show some "amazing grace" to one another, and let's move on altogether now!

[Sittin'n]

Superb suggestion, Yankee! You lead, I'll follow....

[Denim&Co.]

Let's turn our back on this thread...